• Stephanie McDonald

    Clearly this guy doesn’t understand spam. It’s unwanted email. That’s how reasonable people define it, and that’s why people hate recruiters. If we say something like “oh, people who don’t want spam are not people we’d be interested in” WE DESERVE WHAT WE GET. I’d be horrified to be on this list, beg forgiveness and take the criticism I well deserved. He should be ashamed.

    Steph

  • Nik Lygkonis

    Thanks for the mention of our company John. Will consider the t-shirt idea, in the meantime why not check our product – I am confident it will make more sense to you. Email me for details. Thanks Nik

  • Keith Halperin

    My heart bleeds for those poor, stressed-out people who are so upset about getting bombarded with comms from recruiters. I offer a couple of suggestions to those troubled souls:

    1) You want to be left alone? Fine- just be part of the (probable) 95% of jobseekers who would DIE to get a few comms from recruiters, but don’t because unlike you, they’re not part of the “Fab 5%” that everybody wants. What makes these spoiled Fab 5% people feel we should spend hours carefully researching all aspects of their background and spoon-feed them a pre-digested pablum of a perfect job, when we have no guarantee they’d respond anyway?

    2) You still want to be left alone? Well then: get yourself off the publically-accessible internet, and delete every trace of your existence. You have a right to remain silent (on the internet). If you give up the right to remain silent, anything you say (or have ever said or will ever say) will be used against you for any reason we feel like, BECAUSE WE CAN. In a few years, big companies and individuals will have data tools which will cause the current NSA spooks to swoon, and it will be all perfectly legal, since it will rely on public information. If you don’t like it, then move to Europe with their evil data-protection and privacy laws, you SOCIALIST ENEMIES OF FREE ENTEPRISE!

    Happy Friday,
    ‘Cruitaz

  • Stephanie McDonald

    So you’re cool with sending blanket emails to candidates? I’m not talking about getting a well crafted email under the nose of a particular candidate I’ve been looking at. I would never buy a list or pull up “software engineer” in LinkedIn and carpet bomb them all with the same email. It sounds like this guy did the latter. That’s the retailization of our chosen profession, Keith. ANYONE can do that, but no one should. I highly doubt the people complaining have a problem with how things should be done. It’s about relationships, right?

  • Keith Halperin

    Thanks, Stephanie. If I do a search, internet, LI, board, etc. and come up with some results, I’ll do some quick eyeballing to make sure I avoid the type of errors I often receive (getting requests to apply to technical jobs), weeding out people who indicate some reason to avoid, wrong title, wrong skills, etc. and then I’ll send out a professional, appropriate, and polite message to as many of them as seem interesting. I am not going to spend hours researching them to make sure I absolutely have something that they’d want to hear, because there is no guarantee that spending a few seconds or a few hours looking at someone’s background will produce a positive result.

    As far as “relationships” are concerned:
    As the saying goes- “If you have time for relationships, you don’t have enough reqs.”

    Cheers,
    Keith

  • josh kerbel

    I would figure that if I was hunting a high value target, I would at least take the time to do a customized outreach. It’s not much different than pitching to bloggers/media outlets, a potential hit can be worth thousands, so make the investment of time upfront.

  • Keith Halperin

    @ Josh: Very practical if you have a few high-value contingency targets, not so if you have lots of reqs and ones that need to quickly.

  • http://www.verticalelevation.com Carol Schultz

    John: This is such a great story. Thanks for posting it.

  • Sarah Mullens

    Nothing says lazy recruiting louder than a “spray and pray” email.

    • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

      Nothing says “bad recruiter” than a fat wallet and lots of repeat customers

  • Keith Halperin

    Thanks, Sarah.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB_I1YBAozE

    “Ohh , I’m wicked and I’m lazy
    Ohh, Don’t you want to save me

    Lazy when I work
    Lazy all the day
    Screamin all you like but it only fades away
    I’m lazy when I’m prayin
    Lazy on the job
    Gota lazy mind, a lazy eye, a lazy lazy bod”

    -David Byrne, Lazy

  • Nicholas Meyler

    The chief flaw with the article is that it is poorly researched and basically false. Firstly, Zappe apparently doesn’t know that David H. Hansson has an extremely bad reputation (check his Wikipedia entry). Secondly, he ignores the fact that our emails have a complaint rate well below 1 per 30,000 sent, and that we unsubscribe everyone who requests it immediately. We are in complete compliance with the CAN-SPAM laws, and according to the 9th Circuit Court ruling of “Gordon vs. Virtumundo”, any argument with that would need to be overturned by the Supreme Court of the USA. Thirdly, he paints a picture of me being a recruiter without skills, when in fact, I have an engineering degree, and come from a long line of engineers, and have placed people with 7 figure salaries, and work with many candidates with 50 or more patents.

    Anyone with an ounce of common sense knows that a job advertisement is not the same as a spam ad for “penile enlargement”. The comment is clearly libelous. There’s so little that’s accurate about the article (and John Zappe has never been a recruiter for a day in his life) that it’s astonishing. Furthermore, if one researches the backgrounds of the recruiters listed on “Recruiter Spam”, you will see some remarkably talented recruiters, including former Microsoft software engineers who have turned recruiter.

    “Recruiter Spam” is not a credible site, either, given that they base their judgment on well under 100 emails. Clearly, a ridiculously small number.

    David Hansson is perhaps best known for his critique of “enterprise software” having no standards for best practices. Still, all that tells us, as has been mentioned above, is that he is a socialist (red, i.e. “ruby”) critic of American Capitalism and the American Way.

  • Nicholas Meyler

    Another rather interesting thing about “Recruiter Spam” is that they also list a fellow alumni of John Zappe’s (from Syracuse Law School) as having sent more spam than “99%” of all other recruiters combined on “Recruiter Spam”. Obviously, if Law School graduates are recruiting via email, they know it is completely legal. John’s research is poor, and the fact that another graduate of Syracuse Law School is a target leads me to believe that (a) “Recruiter Spam” is a bogus site, and (b) John Zappe’s research is weak.

  • Stephanie McDonald

    Nicholas, maybe I’m misunderstanding but are you saying that because someone graduates from law school they don’t break the law, morals and best practices?

    There wasn’t any reference to law that I recall, this is just lazy and boorish behavior. I don’t care that it’s legal, it doesn’t make it good recruiting.

  • Nicholas Meyler

    Stephanie, you are welcome to your opinion. Maybe I’m misunderstanding, but you think that you are someone whose opinion I respect? It is not boorish to contact people about jobs. If you think it is, you should get out of the industry.

  • Nicholas Meyler

    What is really important here, and why the article isn’t a complete waste of time, is that candidates that hate recruiters for no real reason DO exist. This is a real problem for all of us and should be addressed. In reality, some percentage of the population are sociopathic and will be rude, obnoxious, vulgar and criminal for no reason. Maybe they are brilliant and their egos can’t take being treated like ‘average people’.

    Still, most of the brilliant inventors I have worked with are mature enough to realize “He doesn’t know me, yet,” and want to make a good impression. A very rare few just get angry. DHH has a really bad reputation for getting angry unjustifiably which I was unaware of. Had I known about it, I would have avoided him. Realistically, we cannot know everything a Recruiter might encounter, even after 25 years of successful recruiting in a specific field.

    Recruiters need to understand that they can be victimized by “Hate Crimes” for no reason, maybe just by people who hate recruiters because they are fundamentally unhireable — for example, chronic job-hoppers, unmanageable people, etc.

    I’m friends with many other engineers and many candidates, and I’ve discussed the matter with some of those employed in the same industry as DHH and they assured me that I had done absolutely nothing wrong or the least bit out of the ordinary.

    Zappe’s biggest error is ignoring the Laws of the situation: I was in the right, and completely lawful; while DHH was doing a criminal tort of libel which verged on an effort at cyber-lynching or cyber-stalking. I was also essentially being extorted by a very small number of radicalized people (mostly from Europe) who insisted that I had broken the Law (completely untrue). In my opinion, someone with a degree from Syracuse University Law School who writes for a news journal that targets an audience of recruiters should know better than to take a stance with the losing side, especially when his readership is mostly Headhunters.

    Recruiters need to stand up for each other, think critically about what they read, and not accept everything they are told at ‘face value’. Further inspection of the “Recruiter Spam” website shows it to be bogus. Hundreds among hundreds of recruiters are listed there, for having sent only 1 “spam” email. This is outrageous. Not only that, but it doesn’t really work. I’ve joined, and submitted many email addresses from other recruiters who sent me spam (several hundred addresses), and not one of them shows up! I’m still listed as having submitted O.000% of the addresses. In other words, everything you believed about the Zappe article was a lie. He should have listened when I carefully explained everything to him for 45 minutes over the phone, taking time out of my extremely busy day to try to help.

    I will not make the mistake of ‘trying to help’ in the future.

  • Nicholas Meyler

    As far as the “lazy” recruiter comments go (and I sincerely doubt that nearly any of you who scoff at email recruiting have the patience or intelligence to compile your own extensive email lists)…

    “Progress doesn’t come from early risers — progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things.” — Robert Anson Heinlein, Time Enough for Love

    “I divide officers into four classes — the clever, the lazy, the stupid and the industrious. Each officer possesses at least two of these qualities. Those who are clever and industrious are fitted for the high staff appointments. Use can be made of those who are stupid and lazy. The man who is clever and lazy is fit for the very highest commands. He has the temperament and the requisite nerves to deal with all situations. But whoever is stupid and industrious must be removed immediately.”
    — General Baron Kurt von Hammerstein-Equord

    “Progress doesn’t come from early risers — progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things.” — Robert Anson Heinlein, Time Enough for Love

  • Nicholas Meyler

    This article is monstrously inaccurate and borders on journalistic fraud. Business is way up since this was published, though, largely because the same data cited can easily be used to prove me the most accurate technical recruiter in the world, with the lowest spam rates (from 1 per 10,000 to 1 per 100,000) which are well-below the standard 1 per thousand rate that is considered the acceptable standard. John Zappe fails to mention that “Recruiterspam” also refers to me (and other recruiters)as “wily” and “top recruiter”. Obviously, facts no longer matter in Journalism.

  • Nicholas Meyler

    “Journalistic scandals include: plagiarism, fabrication, and omission of information; activities that violate the law, or violate ethical rules; the altering or staging of an event being documented; or making substantial reporting or researching errors with the results leading to libelous or defamatory statements.” –from Wikipedia entry for “Journalistic Scandal”.

    Seems like the definition fits the article like a glove…

  • Nicholas Meyler

    You forgot to mention that David Heinemeier Hansson has an IQ of 70 (which is a lot higher than yours, obviously). I hear that most of his coding is done with an abacus.

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    “david heinemeier hansson sucks”… try doing a Google Search on that phrase in quotes: 33,500 results. “john zappe sucks”: 2,470,000 results.
    hmmm… this explains why Hansson goes by dhh, since “dhh sucks” only gets 78 results. “Nicholas Meyler sucks”: only 1 result (posted by the guys who suck thousands and millions of times more).

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    A retraction of this entire article has been requested, and the journal refuses to even reply… completely unaccountable, hence dubious.

    Here is an example of what a legitimate publication does when it gets caught with false statistics: http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/40933/title/Brain-Genetics-Paper-Retracted/

  • unnamed

    Spamming tens of thousands of people with online CVs in the hope
    that several will bite is to recruiting what dropping a thousand tonnes
    of bricks hoping for a house is to construction.

    Since we techies are in the business of being lazy ourselves, we aren’t about to waste our time with some unknown that likely doesn’t understand the type of person he’s pitching to, and / or doesn’t understand the opportunity he’s pitching.
    Further, given that it is a drain on our time to have to sift through these unsolicited mailshots (obscuring those emails which really do demand our attention), it is reasonable to suppose that some of us might be a little bit peeved (and insulted).

    • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

      Anyone who calls himself a ‘tekkie’ but doesn’t know how to screen spam out of his email is like a self-proclaimed guru who doesn’t know how to change his own diapers. If you get insulted with the smell of your own diapers, that’s not my problem.

    • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

      Only a moron would complain about people sending email to someone who posted his CV online. By law, and definition, such emails are then not “unsolicited”. Sorry, you’re wrong.

      • unnamed

        Actually it’s you that is wrong. Implicitly, by posting our CVs online, we are soliciting emails from people who actually read them – and will understand the sort of roles we are interested in, and qualified for. We don’t solicit emails from mail-merge monkeys like yourself any more than we solicit them from other spammers.

        Hope this helps :]

        • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

          I don’t know why I waste my time arguing with cretins… leave your house door open with a sign on it that says “help yourself to the food in the fridge” and then complain that people knock on your door before they let themselves in…

        • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

          No self-respecting recruiter has time to read the resume of anyone who is “unnamed”. Loser.

        • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

          If you weren’t illiterate, I’d reply

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    Fake followers of dhh: https://www.twitteraudit.com/dhh

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    With respect to “IRONY”: the actual irony of this situation was that in dhh’s tiny little mind, nothing exists beyond his own skull except pseudo-people whom he clearly feels should somehow, necessarily, be impelled or compelled to assume that he has some superfluous degree of intelligence far beyond all other humans.

    Contrarily, it’s really quite drole to think that someone’s inconsequential book (my suggestion for counterpoint is the title “Let’s All Work Under Our Desks”) should matter to someone else who has never heard of it. Clearly, John Zappe and dhh know even less about irony than Alanis Morrisette (hard to imagine).

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    Spam filters are so effective (95% efficiency) that anything that gets through a spam filter is unlikely to be spam. Job opportunities with 7-figure potential earnings are not spam. Software engineers and self-proclaimed ‘tekkies’ who aren’t smart enough to stop spam from getting in their inboxes make lousy candidates because they have no skills. Software engineers who can’t tell the difference between a job for a PhD and penile enlargement pills are idiots. “Scientists” who back up their assertions with fake statistics that can be shown to be fraud with simple division are puerile and not worthy of being respected, anyway. Case closed. The Fordyce letter is no longer respected, either.

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    Anyone looking for a new client who has tons of great Ruby coders available? NO REMOTE WORK OR TELECOMMUTING AVAILABLE AND NO CONTRACTORS.

    http://www.recruitingblogs.com/forum/topics/any-great-software-recruiters-out-there-ruby-on-rails-c?xg_source=activity

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    Business is up 500% since this absurdly and inanely critical article was published (over a year ago), and I still find it utterly obnoxious and ludicrous. The fact that no retraction has been published only proves that Zappe has no interest in ever having a ‘good reputation’.

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    I think it’s a very interesting commentary on the ethics of Journalism as an industry that it took Brian Williams twelve years to retract an obvious and blatant lie, despite strong pressure from many people, including soldiers and government employees. Still, admitting to having completely confabulated a story supported by fake ‘facts’ is appropriate.

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    I don’t see why the editor keeps removing my posts unless it really bothers him how much everyone doesn’t like him now that everyone knows he’s a liar who completely confabulated a story based on a lie.

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler
  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    Not very viral at all, really. My tweets are reaching about 3x as many people as Hansson’s.

    https://tweetreach.com/reports/13113837

    https://tweetreach.com/reports/13113839

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    Someone should write an article titled “Death to Bad Journalists” and go through a complete history of mistakes in The Fordyce Letter. Move over, Rolling Stone and Brian Williams.

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler
  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2015/04/nbc-news-brian-williams-scandal-comcast

    Turness and the other executives who had gotten involved quickly became frustrated, as they would remain for days, with Williams’s inability to explain himself. “He couldn’t say the words ‘I lied,’ ” recalls one NBC insider. “We could not force his mouth to form the words ‘I lied.’ He couldn’t explain what had happened. [He said,] ‘Did something happen to [my] head? Maybe I had a brain tumor, or something in my head?’ He just didn’t know. We just didn’t know. We had no clear sense what had happened. We got the best [apology] we could get.”

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    Zappe gets zapped in “Old Sparky”… good times!

  • http://nicholasmeyler.brandyourself.com/ Nicholas Meyler

    More people speaking out about churlish, obnoxious, immature behavior by dhh: http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/25h1bv/the_dhh_problem/

  • Julian Cook

    I found that the vast majority of my recruiting spam came from one source (Job Diva) and thanks to http://norecruitingspam.com I figured out how to filter it and blacklist everything relayed to me from their servers. Recruiting is getting SUCH a bad name from the Indian recruiting sweatshops.

  • https://about.me/nicholasmeyler Nicholas Meyler

    Fordyce Letter is also a tremendous source of spam, spamdexing, comment spam, and fraudulent advice masquerading as expertise.

  • https://about.me/nicholasmeyler Nicholas Meyler

    The real problem is that software engineers are very unhappy people sometimes, and take out their pain and grief on those recruiters trying to help them.

    Please see: http://www.creativebloq.com/web-design/we-need-talk-about-developers-and-depression-101413045

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1974658

    and

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/11/23/coders_insomnia_mental_hygiene/